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  • #31
    Originally posted by philso View Post
    The interpretation of knocking out as meaning the blue beam is required to be knocked out of the hinge pin does make sense to me. That would constitute field damage and all teams that are successful in knocking out beams would get no points for doing so.
    I think what the "knock out" promoters are referring to is the "socket" that the free end of the blue beam fits into, under the bottom of the test building part of the model.
    FIRST LEGO League Mentor and Referee/Head Referee since 2011.

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    • #32
      Indeed, I am suggesting that once the free end of the beam has been removed from the socket under the building, it is 100% knocked out. You do not have to move the beam very far at all to completely disengage it from the socket. Therefore, 50% knocked out means something like the beam is still half-engaged with the socket, but half out of the socket.
      Norfolk, Virginia, USA
      FLL Coach and Regional Tournament Head judge since 2014

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      • #33
        Thanks, Tom and Skip. I only get to see and touch the field models for about an hour a week.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by SkipMorrow View Post
          Indeed, I am suggesting that once the free end of the beam has been removed from the socket under the building, it is 100% knocked out. You do not have to move the beam very far at all to completely disengage it from the socket. Therefore, 50% knocked out means something like the beam is still half-engaged with the socket, but half out of the socket.
          :FYI: Instructions to the the regional head referees say that interpretation is not correct. See Steve's comment from yesterday regarding rotation of the beam by at least 45 degrees.
          FIRST LEGO League Mentor and Referee/Head Referee since 2011.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by SkipMorrow View Post
            Thanks, Steve. And do you think the photo in post #20 above scores 60 points?
            Yes, it looks like it would score 60.
            Steve Scherr
            Referee and Judge, Virginia-DC, Maryland, and Ohio
            FLL Global Head Referee

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            • #36
              What is the definition of Test Building? Is the Test Building comprised of the white blocks attached to the tan plates AND the supporting structure which includes the blue beams? Or is the Test Building ONLY the white blocks attached to the tan plates?

              The definition of Test Building determines whether or not we will have Equipment touching the blue beams at the end of the match.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by C3SD View Post
                What is the definition of Test Building? Is the Test Building comprised of the white blocks attached to the tan plates AND the supporting structure which includes the blue beams? Or is the Test Building ONLY the white blocks attached to the tan plates?

                The definition of Test Building determines whether or not we will have Equipment touching the blue beams at the end of the match.
                The Mission Model for "Safety Factor" has two parts:
                • The Test Building is the white blocks attached to the tan plates.
                • The base is the part with the blue beams that attaches to the mat.

                FIRST LEGO League Mentor and Referee/Head Referee since 2011.

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                • #38
                  Thank you Tom. And, I'm sure you knew this was coming...

                  In your opinion, would having Equipment touching the blue beams at the end of the match be cause for disallowing the scoring of blue beams that have been properly knocked out?

                  In a nutshell, my team is testing an attachment (aka Equipment) that knocks out three blue beams; but once it knocks out the beams, the attachment is "locked" in place. The robot would leave the attachment on the table, touching most of the blue beams; and the robot would return to home. In this scenario, the Test Building would be Independent - it would not be touching any Equipment (i.e. the attachment) at the end of the match.

                  If I follow your explanation for the Safety Factor Mission Model, then I think our Equipment "junk" left touching blue beams is okay (meaning, we would score). However, I have nightmares of RG11 haunting me.
                  Last edited by C3SD; 11-23-2019, 04:32 AM.

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                  • #39
                    In your opinion, would having Equipment touching the blue beams at the end of the match be cause for disallowing the scoring of blue beams that have been properly knocked out?
                    "Equipment touching the blue beams" is not discussed in the rules. So you're at the whim of however your referees interpret the "Supported" rule. That's always a risky game strategy. The ref might agree with you, or the team may have to present some convincing reasoning and hope for a Benefit of the Doubt ruling.
                    FIRST LEGO League Mentor and Referee/Head Referee since 2011.

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                    • #40
                      Thank you Tom. I see it the same way you described. I appreciate your clear responses.

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