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M15 - Lander Touch-down getting too loose?

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  • M15 - Lander Touch-down getting too loose?

    Our tower refuses to hold the lander half the time. The mechanism has become loose. Bumping the table will often drop the lander. Sometimes the lander falls spontaneously.

    When putting the lander on make sure:
    - The grips are in the correct position on the lander, and land has slid down snug into the grips.
    - The grey lever on the top of the tower is flush with its surrounding.
    - The light blue lever near the gears is fully rotated inwards.

    Is anyone else having this problem?

    We're hoping that if the lander falls spontaneously during the run, and we can prove we successfully pressed the lever, and have a correctly positioned collection device, the judge will give us points. The problem is if the land falls right in front of the tower, blocking the lever.



  • #2
    Originally posted by mageus View Post
    ...and we can prove we successfully pressed the lever
    Using the lever is not in the mission rule.
    FIRST LEGO League Mentor and Referee/Head Referee since 2011.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Tom Mosher View Post

      Using the lever is not in the mission rule.
      However, pressing the lever, opening the jaws sufficiently, having a basket positioned directly under the jaws, and having the robot return to base unscathed, should count for something, if not the 16 points.


      So, if the lander drops in the middle of the competition, should the referee pick it up? One could argue that its presence on the field interfered with our robot. Is there any protocol for this? Or are the kids expected to account for even this eventuality?

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Tom Mosher View Post

        Using the lever is not in the mission rule.
        They did consider just ramming the tower, seeing how unstable the arms were. Kinda like the Connect Four Rain from last year.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by mageus View Post
          So, if the lander drops in the middle of the competition, should the referee pick it up? One could argue that its presence on the field interfered with our robot. Is there any protocol for this? Or are the kids expected to account for even this eventuality?
          There's no official guidance for what referees should do in this situation.

          Personally, if some part of the field disassembled itself through no action of the team, I'd consider that a field setup error. The Refs could clear the model off of the field, and perhaps try to replace the model into the tower while the match continues if it was possible without disturbing the team's game strategy.



          FIRST LEGO League Mentor and Referee/Head Referee since 2011.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by mageus View Post

            They did consider just ramming the tower, seeing how unstable the arms were. Kinda like the Connect Four Rain from last year.
            There's a long history of teams discovering alternate methods of accomplishing missions.
            FIRST LEGO League Mentor and Referee/Head Referee since 2011.

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            • #7
              Campfire stories? Do tell.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by mageus View Post

                They did consider just ramming the tower, seeing how unstable the arms were. Kinda like the Connect Four Rain from last year.
                My team successfully thwacked (technical term meaning "to beat the heck out of the model with a beam attached to a large motor") the rain out of that model in a couple of competitions. If the rules don't say you can't use brute force, you can! And my team likely will try.
                --
                Fort Worth Robotics - North Texas Region Team #455
                Technical coach, baker of the cookies, keeper of the time, transporter of the travel field walls, finder of the spare parts, maker of the pop culture references that only the other tall people understand, conflict resolution specialist, grey market Lego dealer

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by gt0163c View Post

                  My team successfully thwacked (technical term meaning "to beat the heck out of the model with a beam attached to a large motor") the rain out of that model in a couple of competitions. If the rules don't say you can't use brute force, you can! And my team likely will try.
                  Watch out for R17. YMMV.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by mageus View Post
                    Campfire stories? Do tell.
                    A few years back (Nature's Fury), there was an airplane suspended from a guide line above the field. There was a release lever, but no rule that said you had to use it. Running into the airplane (or jiggling the line by driving underneath it) worked fine as a release method.
                    FIRST LEGO League Mentor and Referee/Head Referee since 2011.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by philso View Post

                      Watch out for R17. YMMV.
                      Yep. I pointed that out to them. They decided that their twacking was gentle enough that it wasn't intended to break the model and, therefore, it was a permissible strategy. I asked them a couple of times if they thought that actually was the case or if they were just taking the easy way out. They were adamant that they were right and any logical ref would agree with them. I invoked my coach's philosophy of stating my opinion, pointing out the rules and asking leading questions two to three times and then stepping back and letting the team deal with whatever came.
                      --
                      Fort Worth Robotics - North Texas Region Team #455
                      Technical coach, baker of the cookies, keeper of the time, transporter of the travel field walls, finder of the spare parts, maker of the pop culture references that only the other tall people understand, conflict resolution specialist, grey market Lego dealer

                      Comment

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